Yet another thread about deciding on iStock exclusivity

[joyfnp]

 I know, I know, it's really up to me, everyone's portfolio is different, but maybe my situation has a slight twist to it...even though my situation is small potatoes...I hope to be a bigger spud someday! 
 I have about 450 pics up on iStock, 241 downloads.  I suspect I will be eligible by the end of June, the way things are going.  Despite all the negatives voiced on this site, iStock is easily my best agency; 4 payouts in 2.5 years.
451 pics on Dreamstime about 260 downloads.  I tried exclusivity on Dreamstime for a bit but then the downloads dried up and went back to Indie.  Haven't uploaded anything in a year so that I could deactivate my portfolio when the time came. 3 payouts in 4 years.  I only had 3 downloads in May so am definitely not holding my breath on Dreamstime
218 pics on Shutterstock and have only made a payout once in 3 years, ~$65 in the bank after a large sale in last year of $14. And it's not for lack of trying to upload more, just kept getting the rejections.

I am definitely going to give iStock exclusiveness a try but I wonder about the timing of it.  Should I wait until I reach a payout on Shutterstock?
Another question I have always had: Is it worth it?  Will I reach a payout per month+ in the foreseeable future?  The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads...Did those of you who are now exclusive / went exclusive with a similar size portfolio see a jump?

[Mantis]

I know, I know, it's really up to me, everyone's portfolio is different, but maybe my situation has a slight twist to it...even though my situation is small potatoes...I hope to be a bigger spud someday! 
 I have about 450 pics up on iStock, 241 downloads.  I suspect I will be eligible by the end of June, the way things are going.  Despite all the negatives voiced on this site, iStock is easily my best agency; 4 payouts in 2.5 years.
451 pics on Dreamstime about 260 downloads.  I tried exclusivity on Dreamstime for a bit but then the downloads dried up and went back to Indie.  Haven't uploaded anything in a year so that I could deactivate my portfolio when the time came. 3 payouts in 4 years.  I only had 3 downloads in May so am definitely not holding my breath on Dreamstime
218 pics on Shutterstock and have only made a payout once in 3 years, ~$65 in the bank after a large sale in last year of $14. And it's not for lack of trying to upload more, just kept getting the rejections.

I am definitely going to give iStock exclusiveness a try but I wonder about the timing of it.  Should I wait until I reach a payout on Shutterstock?
Another question I have always had: Is it worth it?  Will I reach a payout per month+ in the foreseeable future?  The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads...Did those of you who are now exclusive / went exclusive with a similar size portfolio see a jump?

Out of curiosity, why are you asking this:



Is it worth it?  Will I reach a payout per month+ in the foreseeable future?  The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads...Did those of you who are now exclusive / went exclusive with a similar size portfolio see a jump?

If you have decided on this:

I am definitely going to give iStock exclusiveness a try

You will likely get "no" answers to "is it worth it". If you do does that change your mind in any way?

[joyfnp]

Out of curiosity, why are you asking this:



Is it worth it?  Will I reach a payout per month+ in the foreseeable future?  The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads...Did those of you who are now exclusive / went exclusive with a similar size portfolio see a jump?

If you have decided on this:

I am definitely going to give iStock exclusiveness a try

You will likely get "no" answers to "is it worth it". If you does that change your mind in any way?
[/quote]

You're right, Mantis, wrong question, I guess.  Forget I asked that particular question and skip to the rest.  Merely uploading as an independent at iStock has already been worth it, since they are my best agency.

[cobalt]

Why don't you open a thread on istock and ask the people that went exclusive in the last 12 months if they are happy with their decision?

Would they recommend you become exclusive? Are the results what they expected? Or do they regret their decision?

I think getting opinions from people who have been exclusive for many years will not give you the real scenario. They often have files in good search positions,because they had great sales in the past.

But people who just went exclusive should be able to tell you what it is like coming in now. Especially if new work sells. That is the most important.

Whatever you do, good luck. istock has lots of nice people and the lypses are fun.

[Mantis]

Out of curiosity, why are you asking this:



Is it worth it?  Will I reach a payout per month+ in the foreseeable future?  The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads...Did those of you who are now exclusive / went exclusive with a similar size portfolio see a jump?

If you have decided on this:

I am definitely going to give iStock exclusiveness a try

You will likely get "no" answers to "is it worth it". If you does that change your mind in any way?

You're right, Mantis, wrong question, I guess.  Forget I asked that particular question and skip to the rest.  Merely uploading as an independent at iStock has already been worth it, since they are my best agency.
[/quote]

I have not been exclusive anywhere, but several people here have like Shadysue, JSnover and Sean Locks and other are still exclusive.  It's your decision. Personally I am not big on exclusivity because of the risk.  And Istock, in particular, has done a lot to erode sales for their exclusives. You also have to ask yourself what you are trying to get out of stock: a few extra bucks or build a longer term plan to grow your income? For me, I am looking at longer term and I contribute to over 10 agencies and it's a pain in the rump to manage these, usually while uploading.  but if you find a shady agency, some make it hard to remove your images especially from their partner sites.  They basically keep selling your work when you get nothing and can't get them to pull your port.  I think someone here has been fighting with Dreamstime after they closed their accounts but are still finding images on DT partner sites.

So there is risk by broadening your submissions as a non, and advantages being exclusive. You have to weight these options and these options get pretty hairy the larger your port gets. You have a small port so your decision, today, will be easier than 5 years from now when you have 2000-3000 images.

[ShadySue]

Looks as though FOR YOU, iS exclusivity could be worth trying, since it's your best agency. If you have only started recently, and have got that many sales, you're doing well.
Most of us are finding that our recent uploads are hardly getting views far less sales, and that has been since late September 2012. So if you've started since then, you may have a niche that iStock buyers want.

You don't have much to lose. If you try it and it doesn't work, you only have to give 30 days notice to become indie again.

However,remember that your file prices will increase considerably. If it happens (I don't know your port, so I'm not being personal) that you've been getting sales by being able to undercut existing exclusive files, you'll be competing directly on a level playing field - and maybe there will be other indies in your subject matter / style who will then be undercutting you.

Good luck whatever you decide. Note that I'm exclusive by choice (my RCs are going down, most months, but I know I'd do badly on SS), Jo Ann is independent  by choice (having been exclusive for a while), and Sean's position (not in iS at all) was forced upon him.

[Jo Ann Snover]

I'm speaking as an ex iStock exclusive (I was indie 2004-8, exlcusive 2008-11 and back to indie in June 2011), but I don't think, even if iStock is currently your best earner, that it's likely to be a good move for you to go exclusive.

The one reason I'd think it would make sense is if you have some decent quantity of images that will be in the Signature and Vetta collections - and without knowing your portfolio, it's just hard to say. With such a small portfolio, it's possible that one or two files that took off are responsible for the bulk of your downloads. That makes you very vulnerable to one shift in the sort order (at one agency).

I can understand not having warm feelings towards Shutterstock given your track record with them, but that's (right now) where the growth is. iStock has lost the plot, IMO, and have a very vulnerable portfolio (small size and very small sales) at a wobbly agency just doesn't seem like a good idea. I'd work on getting more accepted at Shutterstock, upload to 123rf and possibly PhotoDune (I'd stay away from Fotolia and Deposit Photos based on some of their recent shenanigans but they can both earn money, although not at the level Shutterstock can.

Good luck

[luissantos84]

I know, I know, it's really up to me, everyone's portfolio is different, but maybe my situation has a slight twist to it...even though my situation is small potatoes...I hope to be a bigger spud someday! 
 I have about 450 pics up on iStock, 241 downloads.  I suspect I will be eligible by the end of June, the way things are going.  Despite all the negatives voiced on this site, iStock is easily my best agency; 4 payouts in 2.5 years.
451 pics on Dreamstime about 260 downloads.  I tried exclusivity on Dreamstime for a bit but then the downloads dried up and went back to Indie.  Haven't uploaded anything in a year so that I could deactivate my portfolio when the time came. 3 payouts in 4 years.  I only had 3 downloads in May so am definitely not holding my breath on Dreamstime
218 pics on Shutterstock and have only made a payout once in 3 years, ~$65 in the bank after a large sale in last year of $14. And it's not for lack of trying to upload more, just kept getting the rejections.

I am definitely going to give iStock exclusiveness a try but I wonder about the timing of it.  Should I wait until I reach a payout on Shutterstock?
Another question I have always had: Is it worth it?  Will I reach a payout per month+ in the foreseeable future?  The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads...Did those of you who are now exclusive / went exclusive with a similar size portfolio see a jump?

lets talk about numbers because I would never jump at iStock's exclusivity (but looking at your situation perhaps)

iStock
- 400$
- 241 downloads
- 30 months
- 13.33$ / month

Dreamstime
- 300$
- 260 downloads
- 48 months
- 6.25$ / month

Shutterstock
- 165$
- whatever downloads
- 36 months
- 4.58$ / month

from the previous discussions here at MSG regarding iStock exclusivity I would say you would make 8 times more you are now doing

13.33$ x 8 = 106.64

13.33$ x 4 = 53.32

that said there are a few (maybe a ton) other things like portfolio size/quality, best match changes, agency situation/buyers etc that can change that number considerable, I also believe that your portfolio is too small to draw many conclusions but it would get you certainly more exposure

[ShadySue]

Some people have said they were making 8x as much as an exclusive as indie with their particular port, but they said they were selling lots of Signature Plus and Vetta files, and also doing well with Getty. That situation doesn't apply to all exclusives, and files can sell at Getty for a matter of cents, though larger sales are perfectly possible.

We can't transfer files over to Sig+ nowadays, iStock do it, and from what I read, it seems pretty random. Also, the latest thing is that they are accepting some exclusive files as Main. I had one last week, for which I can find no other similar file on iS or SS, for example (i.e. not an 'apple on white' type of shot). They can also demote files from Sig+ also apparently at random, and it doesn't seem to matter whether the files have been selling at Sig+ or not.

Also, the people who said they were making a lot were saying that before subs started. It's hard to say at the moment, but it seems quite likely that a proportion of their regular buyers will switch to subs when their current credit bundles run out, reducing our RPD.

You just have to suck it and see. Or not.
"Past performance is no guarantee of future results."

OTOH, judging by threads here, something freaky happened at SS last month - people have been reporting random rejections and after months when people were reporting BMEs about every month, now suddenly for May there are a lot more 'not so good' reports than usual.

Notice how often 'random' seems to apply.

[luissantos84]

THAT explains a ton better the exclusivity scenario, I just have a thing with numbers and I couldn't resist haha

[shudderstok]

this forum most likely is not the best place to even hint at being interested in IS as an entity. there is a big hate on here for anything IS. if one even posts anything positive or has a differing view of IS they will get blasted. trust me i know.
that all said, there are many ways to skin a cat. i for one don't see any point in wasting my valuable time uploading to many sites, whereas there are others here who swear by it.
do the math. at one point it makes more sense to be in many agencies as IS pays a pathetic amount of 15%. so the combined agencies might make more sense. now if you are exclusive i think you make 25% as a starting point, the quickly move up to 30% with the right amount of very stupid RC. if the math concludes you will make more by the added % then yes it makes sense to be exclusive.
that all said as well, IS has now started competing against the race to the bottom and initiated sub sales that give you no credits, which in my opinion is about the dumbest thing they can do to attract contributors to be exclusive as there stands a very good chance your rates will be stuck at the lowest point possible while committing to a unilateral and selfish contract, thus making the possibility of being indie a good option.
for me my eyes are monitoring the situation very closely, and at this point in time it makes more sense to be exclusive, but with GI constantly tampering with things the scales could very slowly start tipping against them and make more sense to abandon them in terms of being exclusive.

 

[joyfnp]

Thanks everyone for your thoughtful replies.  Mantis, I am looking to supplement my income in retirement. If there's anything as shaky as microstock right now, it's gotta be the US social security system, which I am sorry to say I will be relying on in about 11 years.  Luis, thank you for the mathematics - 8x, huh? I'll take it.  Sue, you're very right that I don't have much to lose and can change my mind. Joann, Shutterstock is a mystery to me, I don't know what I'm doing wrong, but doing as well as I am at iStock (not big yet, but I'm pleased) leaves me not very enthusiastic about trying to figure it out. Cobalt, I like your suggestion, but am a little reluctant.  After I posted my observation about Yuri's photo having sold 4.2 Billion times in just 3 days, one person replied to me and then the thread was locked.  The person who replied was a moderator. 
 
Joy istockphoto.com/joyfnp

[gemmy12]

i would say try exclusivity as your images are performing better in istock. Going exclusive to non exclusive is easy but the other way is not i think especially when you have spread images in many sites (and hence their partner sites) because its really hard and unreliable whether the pp sites also have also stopped selling your images after months of closing your a/c in the parent microstock site. Again if stock photography is not your only job then it may may be harder to upload and maintaining large portfolio in multiple sites though there are some tools to upload at multiple agencies at a time. I myself now uploading to 2-3 agencies only though i am non exclusive. If i were at your place, i would have tried exclusivity. But be ready to also accept the negative aspect of exclusivity if you face in future. Good luck.

[MxR]

Try be exclusive, if micro is only a hobbie for you.... you will have more time to do more photos.

[Karen]

Read this thread before - "How to get off from iStock exclusivity?":
http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/how-to-get-off-from-istock-exclusivity/

[heywoody]

On a RPI basis IS seems to be in the same ballpark as SS for me (down from a point where it was paying out 3 times a year on 36 images).  I think the question you need to ask is what % of your IS income comes from PP?  The IS bit will increase but dunno about that bit.  Would the extra IS commissions, keeping in mind the possible impact of subs, compensate for the combined income from SS, DT, FT, 123 + whatever else you might be interested in?

[Gannet77]

It's a difficult call.

I like your portfolio - very nice images there - and I feel it probably does suit iStock well, as you suggest it has so far, but the only way to getting a decent return from them, it seems to me, is to have your best sellers on S+ and GI, and at present they don't have any path to managing that, other than to hope the inspectors will look kindly on your pictures.

I am in the fortunate position of having been there when we could select images for S+, and most of those I chose got ported to GI (it was supposed to be all, but the iStock IT gremlins are ever present) which pays very well - about 30% of my total income comes from GI each month, and on average nearly half of my sales have come from S+.  If I didn't have those I doubt it would be worth my keeping my Exclusivity.

I don't know what happens to your portfolio when you go Exclusive nowadays - given the inspectors have apparently been given leave to downgrade images to Main (or upgrade to S+, supposedly) it may be they will allocate a number of them to a higher collection, and it may even be that those will get ported on to GI, but this has been an issue for a while in the Exclusive forum (those gremlins) so, again, difficult.

It would be good if someone who has more recently opted for Exclusive could come in and say what happened to them, in regards both to relative income and movement of images to higher collections;  that might help you to decide.

Good luck and best wishes in any case!

[ShadySue]

The enticement page says that I will see a difference in the number of downloads.

But note that it doesn't promise an increase, just a 'difference'.
Most of us have had steadily diminishing downloads for a while now. Prices have risen, but that balance is precarious.

Note also that several of the enticements which were offered when I signed up have now disappeared; they can change anything they want.

After I posted my observation about Yuri's photo having sold 4.2 Billion times in just 3 days, one person replied to me and then the thread was locked.  The person who replied was a moderator. 

That was a bug. There was nothing else to be said on that issue, so why keep the thread open?

[cobalt]

Although it is true that when you leave istock exclusivity your income will drop over 80%, however I have never heard or seen of a case where someone goes exclusive and their income rises 800%. I have seen people double their income. Maybe if someone goes exclusive and then all files go Vetta or something that such an extreme increase is possible, but 8 times more? Sounds very extreme to me. We would be hearing that all the time, if it was possible.

Like others have said, success on istock depends very much on the number of high priced files you have - s+ and Vetta.

You could also ask istock on the forums, or maybe in a contributor mail, how many of your files would be selected for s+ or vetta. I am sure someone could give you an idea to help you make your decision.

And this is also something I would ask recent exclusives.

[ARTPUPPY]

As an exclusive since 2007 I can tell you that I am not sure about the future of istock as it stands. Shutterstock seems to be taking over in the sales race. Istock is owned by Getty Images which only pays out a flat 20% royalty so in the long run, it doesn't make business sense to pay exclusives more. A change is coming with regards to exclusives and the RC system since istock is now openly advertising their subscriptions on the website. Also you need to factor in the risk involved - Google Drive - who knows if another deal is in the works? If you become exclusive your images could be included and be rendered worthless if they set up another secret deal. Since your income is low and you're more in the "hobby business" right now, I would look into Symbiostock and work towards becoming 100% independent. Start up costs would be low and if you can't set up your site in wordpress, you can hire an overseas programmer to build it for you for very little. Once you get it up and running with a little extra time you can build your portfolio there and make nearly 100% of the royalties and sleep well at night. If you want to be doing this for the long term (10 years+) then ask yourself what you want to be doing in year 5, 10 etc. Will it be extra work? Sure, but work hard now to get it up and running and it could pay off later... at least you'll be the captain of your own ship. 

[MichaelJayFoto]

I doubt it says "more downloads" somewhere. It's things like "preferred placement" or stuff that can be said but not really measured.

What you should consider: Are your images good enough to still compete when they are priced higher? The first thing you will notice when going exclusive is that your images suddenly will cost $10 or $30 instead of $3 or $5. Do you believe customers will want to pay more for your images? It's hard to say for any of us but it's a key question. It's almost impossible to predict the before/after development of your royalties. You will lose parts of your income that now comes from the Partner Program. We don't know yet how the new subscription at iStock are influencing the customer behavior.

Personally, I have made the decision to go non-exclusive after six years of exclusivity at iStock, and I am now making about double the money I have made two years ago. But I also invested a lot of time and effort into this. Personally, I feel better knowing that I can shoot different types of images and market them through different channels. I wouldn't want to rely on a single company to provide most of my income.