Author Topic: general climate is stock, changing or not? (Read 40569 times)

Lagereek · « **on:** August 14, 2012, 01:33 »

I have kept a very close eye on this for the past 5 months, plus some friends have also done the same. RM, RF, Micro. Our three main outlets. RM and RF, are without doubt catching up and fast, the actual quantity of sales is increasing a lot. Somebody I know had a staggering 72, smaller RM sales in the last month and a half, for being RM, thats a staggering quantity. My own observation is exactly the same.

Micro, OTOH and as we all know is decreasing and thats right across the board, little doubt about that.

Could it be? for all non serious buyers there are ofcourse millions of what we call pro buyers, regular buyers and they have the budgets, weather its 20 bucks, 100 or more. well, to save themselves from todays obvious hassle with the micro industry, are they reverting back to more traditional searching and buying? where customer relations are friendlier and more professional, etc.
The only RM/RF, agency where I have not seen increase is Alamy, all the others show a huge rise in smaller quantity sales. For the first time Im seeing small, RM/RF, sales of around 50-70 dollars and frankly thats not much more then an xxl sale at IS or a single sale at SS.

anybody else here with the same views or thoughts?

sharpshot · « **Reply #1 on:** August 14, 2012, 01:53 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 01:33

...Micro, OTOH and as we all know is decreasing and thats right across the board, little doubt about that.

Is it? I think there might be a problem with over supply but my earnings seem fairly stable. The sites don't seem to be seeing a decrease, look how much FT was sold for. Who would spend that much on a site in a decreasing market. There's lots of people here complaining about a fall in sales but check back in October and it will probably be different. There always seems to be lots of moaning about sales this time of the year. And how many people here have a relatively small portfolio that's trying to compete with people like Yuri?

It's a shame that alamy hasn't seen a pick up in RM sales, that's the only site I'm using for RM. Perhaps it's time I looked elsewhere but I really like using them and will persist for a few more months. They might of seen an increase in RM sales but there's so many images, its not made a difference to individual contributors. There's a few people reporting much improved sales but not many. Hopefully the changes they're working on will bring in more buyers.

Lagereek · « **Reply #2 on:** August 14, 2012, 02:39 »

Quote from: sharpshot on August 14, 2012, 01:53

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 01:33
...Micro, OTOH and as we all know is decreasing and thats right across the board, little doubt about that.
Is it? I think there might be a problem with over supply but my earnings seem fairly stable. The sites don't seem to be seeing a decrease, look how much FT was sold for. Who would spend that much on a site in a decreasing market. There's lots of people here complaining about a fall in sales but check back in October and it will probably be different. There always seems to be lots of moaning about sales this time of the year. And how many people here have a relatively small portfolio that's trying to compete with people like Yuri?

It's a shame that alamy hasn't seen a pick up in RM sales, that's the only site I'm using for RM. Perhaps it's time I looked elsewhere but I really like using them and will persist for a few more months. They might of seen an increase in RM sales but there's so many images, its not made a difference to individual contributors. There's a few people reporting much improved sales but not many. Hopefully the changes they're working on will bring in more buyers.

Well yes ofcourse its decreasing, one doesnt have to look in their sales-ledgers, its enough just listening to all the sales threads in every single micro agency. Alamy, well, its a great agency and very friendly but they have their special and very,very regular buyers, mainly European and I bet som 70%, but sceneics and landscapes. Not my nieche. Apart from that, great agency. Theres always been moaning and groaning but this time its just too many ppl, too many threads, etc.

Microbius · « **Reply #3 on:** August 14, 2012, 04:24 »

It is worth bearing in mind that people doing well don't tend to report in the sales threads, nothing in it for them except more competition.

Reef · « **Reply #4 on:** August 14, 2012, 06:24 »

Pointless thread. Every single person has their own unique perspective on this depending on their circumstances. And one thing that's certain on this forum is most people are in the "my glass is half empty" camp, so it's always a biased view. Except maybe Lagereek who flip flops on everything. No doubt he writes these threads to distract everyone from actually creating stock. You got me for 2 minutes. bugger

EmberMike · « **Reply #5 on:** August 14, 2012, 08:09 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 01:33

...Could it be? for all non serious buyers there are ofcourse millions of what we call pro buyers, regular buyers and they have the budgets, weather its 20 bucks, 100 or more. well, to save themselves from todays obvious hassle with the micro industry, are they reverting back to more traditional searching and buying? where customer relations are friendlier and more professional, etc...

I've always suspected that the different markets could coexist, and micro wouldn't ever really swallow up RF or RM. RM will always exist because of the need of some buyers to have tight control over the images they use, limiting competitor use of the same image, etc. If anything, RM should theoretically see improvements on the basis of micro becoming more popular, and the increased likelihood of the same image image being used by many companies/buyers. Companies more concerned about seeing the image they used in an ad appearing elsewhere at the same time will always need RM, moreso now than ever before.

Even traditional RF can be viewed this way. I used to work at an agency that bought mostly from istock, but used Getty for the more high-end clients just to reduce the chances of seeing an overly used microstock image in their marketing and advertising, and then used RM for the really crucial high-end stuff. That or custom shoots for the really big clients (major credit card companies and such).

It's just different markets, and I think all of them are very necessary and will always be needed. Micro is doing well for me. I don't do RM and the closest thing to traditional RF I'm doing is Alamy, which is actually also showing signs of improvement. But in a way it isn't surprising. I still think these different markets can exist independently of each other, and although they are affected negatively by each other in some ways, in other ways they are helped by the existence of each other.

ShadySue · « **Reply #6 on:** August 14, 2012, 08:16 »

Quote from: Reef on August 14, 2012, 06:24

Except maybe Lagereek who flip flops on everything.

It's probably the Lager that does it.

thesentinel · « **Reply #7 on:** August 14, 2012, 09:29 »

Quote from: ShadySue on August 14, 2012, 08:16

Quote from: Reef on August 14, 2012, 06:24
Except maybe Lagereek who flip flops on everything.
It's probably the Lager that does it.

On the other hand the 'eek' seems more likely to be the culprit to me

pro@stockphotos · « **Reply #8 on:** August 14, 2012, 09:52 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 01:33

I have kept a very close eye on this for the past 5 months, plus some friends have also done the same. RM, RF, Micro. Our three main outlets. RM and RF, are without doubt catching up and fast, the actual quantity of sales is increasing a lot. Somebody I know had a staggering 72, smaller RM sales in the last month and a half, for being RM, thats a staggering quantity. My own observation is exactly the same.

Micro, OTOH and as we all know is decreasing and thats right across the board, little doubt about that.

Could it be? for all non serious buyers there are ofcourse millions of what we call pro buyers, regular buyers and they have the budgets, weather its 20 bucks, 100 or more. well, to save themselves from todays obvious hassle with the micro industry, are they reverting back to more traditional searching and buying? where customer relations are friendlier and more professional, etc.
The only RM/RF, agency where I have not seen increase is Alamy, all the others show a huge rise in smaller quantity sales. For the first time Im seeing small, RM/RF, sales of around 50-70 dollars and frankly thats not much more then an xxl sale at IS or a single sale at SS.

anybody else here with the same views or thoughts?

It seems that IS was on its way to domination until the sale. Then the hammer was dropped and the goal at IS was to squeeze out short term gains to beef up the next sale. It may have backfired. The biggest problem is the artist that should be featured are crowed out by too much inferior work. It should have been managed like RM as far as who could get in and stay in. No sales and a lot of files gets you kicked off. Like they do at a record label. Also they allow too much "non stock photos" as far as quality. Why is Istock so particular in the vetting process to join and then the inspectors allow garbage to fill up the servers. Also for a couple of years Yuri and monkey were dominating the best match as a non-exclusive. Might as well advertised under these photos "cheaper at SS". IS was using these people to mark up their profits for the next sale. But it took a lot out of the momentum. Istock was a freight train and it takes a lot of time to stop one of these when they at peak speed. Maybe people are tired of wading through the mountains of garbage to find a cheap deal.

StockBottom · « **Reply #9 on:** August 14, 2012, 10:29 »

sorry but nowadays you either sell on Getty (RF or RM) or you will just make peanuts with the other agencies.

micros : they're a good place where you can dump and sell images that don't fit or sell on Getty.

each and every agency is sort of "specialized" on something, people thinking about exclusivity should really think
twice about it unless their specific niche is really selling like hotcakes in that specific agency.

EmberMike · « **Reply #10 on:** August 14, 2012, 11:40 »

Quote from: StockBottom on August 14, 2012, 10:29

sorry but nowadays you either sell on Getty (RF or RM) or you will just make peanuts with the other agencies.

micros : they're a good place where you can dump and sell images that don't fit or sell on Getty...

Huh. So I guess all of the people who make a living in microstock have somehow managed to convince the bill and tax collectors to accept peanuts as payment.

cthoman · « **Reply #11 on:** August 14, 2012, 11:46 »

Quote from: EmberMike on August 14, 2012, 11:40

Quote from: StockBottom on August 14, 2012, 10:29
sorry but nowadays you either sell on Getty (RF or RM) or you will just make peanuts with the other agencies.

micros : they're a good place where you can dump and sell images that don't fit or sell on Getty...

Huh. So I guess all of the people who make a living in microstock have somehow managed to convince the bill and tax collectors to accept peanuts as payment.

Yeah, but it's hard to get the peanuts in the envelopes.

lisafx · « **Reply #12 on:** August 14, 2012, 11:56 »

Quote from: cthoman on August 14, 2012, 11:46

Quote from: EmberMike on August 14, 2012, 11:40
Quote from: StockBottom on August 14, 2012, 10:29
sorry but nowadays you either sell on Getty (RF or RM) or you will just make peanuts with the other agencies.

micros : they're a good place where you can dump and sell images that don't fit or sell on Getty...

Huh. So I guess all of the people who make a living in microstock have somehow managed to convince the bill and tax collectors to accept peanuts as payment.

Yeah, but it's hard to get the peanuts in the envelopes.

I find it's easiest if you mash them into peanut butter and then coat the inside of the envelope

cthoman · « **Reply #13 on:** August 14, 2012, 11:59 »

Quote from: lisafx on August 14, 2012, 11:56

Quote from: cthoman on August 14, 2012, 11:46
Quote from: EmberMike on August 14, 2012, 11:40
Quote from: StockBottom on August 14, 2012, 10:29
sorry but nowadays you either sell on Getty (RF or RM) or you will just make peanuts with the other agencies.

micros : they're a good place where you can dump and sell images that don't fit or sell on Getty...

Huh. So I guess all of the people who make a living in microstock have somehow managed to convince the bill and tax collectors to accept peanuts as payment.

Yeah, but it's hard to get the peanuts in the envelopes.

I find it's easiest if you mash them into peanut butter and then coat the inside of the envelope

That's genius! My bill collectors are going to be so happy now.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #14 on:** August 14, 2012, 11:59 »

Quote from: lisafx on August 14, 2012, 11:56

Quote from: cthoman on August 14, 2012, 11:46
Quote from: EmberMike on August 14, 2012, 11:40
Quote from: StockBottom on August 14, 2012, 10:29
sorry but nowadays you either sell on Getty (RF or RM) or you will just make peanuts with the other agencies.

micros : they're a good place where you can dump and sell images that don't fit or sell on Getty...

Huh. So I guess all of the people who make a living in microstock have somehow managed to convince the bill and tax collectors to accept peanuts as payment.

Yeah, but it's hard to get the peanuts in the envelopes.

I find it's easiest if you mash them into peanut butter and then coat the inside of the envelope

big big fan of peanuts but no thank you lol

Lagereek · « **Reply #15 on:** August 14, 2012, 12:02 »

Quote from: Reef on August 14, 2012, 06:24

Pointless thread. Every single person has their own unique perspective on this depending on their circumstances. And one thing that's certain on this forum is most people are in the "my glass is half empty" camp, so it's always a biased view. Except maybe Lagereek who flip flops on everything. No doubt he writes these threads to distract everyone from actually creating stock. You got me for 2 minutes. bugger

Well reef, I am sorry mate but this thread is for ppl, whos been a long time in the stock business, far longer then before micro, consequently, your post is rather irrelevant.

ShadySue · « **Reply #16 on:** August 14, 2012, 13:10 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 12:02

Well reef, I am sorry mate but this thread is for ppl, whos been a long time in the stock business, far longer then before micro, consequently, your post is rather irrelevant.

Who made you God?

Druid · « **Reply #17 on:** August 14, 2012, 13:58 »

Quote from: ShadySue on August 14, 2012, 13:10

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 12:02

Well reef, I am sorry mate but this thread is for ppl, whos been a long time in the stock business, far longer then before micro, consequently, your post is rather irrelevant.
Who made you God?

How do you know how long he has been in the "Stock business". You probably have no idea who he/she is. And as this is an open forum............

Druid · « **Reply #18 on:** August 14, 2012, 14:02 »

Back to the original subject.

The stock market like any business will evolve and as long as there is a demand then It will grow.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #19 on:** August 14, 2012, 14:23 »

Quote from: StockBottom on August 14, 2012, 14:20

Quote from: lisafx on August 14, 2012, 11:56

I find it's easiest if you mash them into peanut butter and then coat the inside of the envelope

try with vaseline then.
excuse me, who do you think you are ?

can't see why i even bother to reply.

classy

sharpshot · « **Reply #20 on:** August 14, 2012, 14:32 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 02:39

....Well yes of course its decreasing, one doesnt have to look in their sales-ledgers, its enough just listening to all the sales threads in every single micro agency. Alamy, well, its a great agency and very friendly but they have their special and very,very regular buyers, mainly European and I bet som 70%, but sceneics and landscapes. Not my nieche. Apart from that, great agency. Theres always been moaning and groaning but this time its just too many ppl, too many threads, etc.

Haven't most of us had a nice boost with SS this year? The only sites that are really down for me are istock and FT. That doesn't mean either of them are doing badly, unfortunately we don't have access to all the numbers. There's a lot of guessing here but really isn't that all it is? As I'm hardly producing any new microsotck images, I'm actually surprised how well my earnings have held up. And there's always lots of complaining about low sales in summer. It gets worse every year because more people hit the wall and join the complainers.

If there's still a slump after October, the fat lady can start singing but at the moment, I don't think there's any sign of her.

cthoman · « **Reply #21 on:** August 14, 2012, 14:55 »

Quote from: sharpshot on August 14, 2012, 14:32

Haven't most of us had a nice boost with SS this year? The only sites that are really down for me are istock and FT. That doesn't mean either of them are doing badly, unfortunately we don't have access to all the numbers. There's a lot of guessing here but really isn't that all it is? As I'm hardly producing any new microsotck images, I'm actually surprised how well my earnings have held up. And there's always lots of complaining about low sales in summer. It gets worse every year because more people hit the wall and join the complainers.

If there's still a slump after October, the fat lady can start singing but at the moment, I don't think there's any sign of her.

I tend to agree. I haven't been uploading at the majors either (for about 2 years) and things have been fairly stable. I am uploading elsewhere though, and things have been growing there. I'd say it's a mix of good and bad, but my expectations/standards have probably changed (they are higher) more than the industry actually has. If anything I would say micro isn't changing fast enough to meet the evolving needs. Maybe, that is why you see some buyers and contributors going back to traditional stock.

Reef · « **Reply #22 on:** August 14, 2012, 16:19 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 12:02

Quote from: Reef on August 14, 2012, 06:24
Pointless thread. Every single person has their own unique perspective on this depending on their circumstances. And one thing that's certain on this forum is most people are in the "my glass is half empty" camp, so it's always a biased view. Except maybe Lagereek who flip flops on everything. No doubt he writes these threads to distract everyone from actually creating stock. You got me for 2 minutes. bugger

Well reef, I am sorry mate but this thread is for ppl, whos been a long time in the stock business, far longer then before micro, consequently, your post is rather irrelevant.

oh Lagereek, thee of little faith. You remind me that there is always the danger of falling into the dinosaur trap which many people are oblivious to. Something for everyone to consider there.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #23 on:** August 14, 2012, 16:21 »

sorry leaf but are we keeping a person that told us to F off ??

ShadySue · « **Reply #24 on:** August 14, 2012, 16:30 »

Quote from: Lagereek on August 14, 2012, 01:33

anybody else here with the same views or thoughts?

Sorry, I missed this.
You only want replies from people who agree with your premise.
The point of that would be ...?

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Author Topic: general climate is stock, changing or not? (Read 40569 times)

Lagereek

sharpshot

Lagereek

Microbius

Reef

EmberMike

ShadySue

thesentinel

pro@stockphotos

StockBottom

EmberMike

cthoman

lisafx

cthoman

luissantos84

Lagereek

ShadySue

Druid

Druid

luissantos84

sharpshot

cthoman

Reef

luissantos84

ShadySue

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